Meth synth shortcut? - the Hive BB

the Hive BB

Crystal Meth

Meth synth shortcut?

profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Author	Topic: Meth synth shortcut?
bluenote Junior Member	posted 10-28-1999 03:14 AM Theoretically, what would be the result of filtering the hi/p/e rxn diluted with dh20, and utilizing the un-eveporated remains? The reason I ask is, my grandma has tried to complete the proccess and has major problems with phing and moving the solution to and from polar/non-polar solvents. It goes something like this: After reacting 5g i2, 4g E, and 3g rp............expected signs occur, ie. yellow/white fumes, bubbling, then thinning maroon mud, ect. add equal amount dh20, filter several times(reddish color doesnt go away), add ronsonal, then lye until ph on water is about 12-14. At this point grandma assumes the goods went into the fuel. Then the water/lye is removed and replaced with clean water and HCL is added, but ph seems to remain low despite the amount of HCL added. When water is evaped some wierd crap remains. Bitter, yet seemingly not ephed or anything else good. Anyway, the big question is: would it be possible to avoid the proccess after the main reaction at all? Grandma isnt too concerened with quality at this point. And is fully aware of how stupid and unskilled she seems, but shes tried this several times and is sick of baking fucked up cookies! Thanks for the advice, and flames are more than welcome.
CHEMMAN Member	posted 10-28-1999 06:25 AM Not concerned with quality??????Leave out the AB extraction?????????? This is so fucking stupid.Why not just swallow some cyanide and get it over with quicker .Tell Grandma to stick with baking cookies.
spitball Administrator	posted 10-28-1999 07:24 AM Shortcut...? Yeah. buy it from someone else. I hate people sometimes. -Spitball-
Midnight Rush Member	posted 10-28-1999 07:47 AM Tell ya what. After my first dream I'll sell you 3grms for 20 bucks. Well ok, 250mg cut with the closest powder to me at the time. Atleast your chances of survival would improve.
CHEMMAN Member	posted 10-28-1999 07:57 AM If you cant do an AB extraction,you should not do any of this ,let alone try to shortcut ( it wont work )and possibly harm someone through your incompetence.Dont close it yet Spitball,they deserve all the shit coming!!
Hematite Member	posted 10-28-1999 09:22 AM Actually, now that the topic of shortcuts has been opened.... With all this pill modification lately in the attempt to thwart our most valiant efforts and make our lives all work and no play; I now wonder if we wouldn't have more luck with a little shortcut I've been pondering, and that is to put any number of untouched pills (of any description-different effects would be part of the lucky dip)into a blender and then use worlocks dry and chiled reactants method, except that in this variation we just use the strongest and acid like stuff we have around. Blend on high for 3 minutes and carefully filter to remove possible toxic ingredients(well the bigger bits anyway)and suger to taste and you have a smoothie that's bound to do something ! Please dont flame just cause the finer points have been glossed over, and only knowlegable people reply please ------------------ Regards,Hematite.
Xaja Member	posted 10-28-1999 04:31 PM Hematite I tried a short-cut much like that once. Took days for my sight to return...
bluenote Junior Member	posted 10-28-1999 05:00 PM CHEMMAN, Spitball: I guess the "acedemic" aspect of this procedure is the real purpose here huh? I`m sure "legetimate" chemists really respect your benevolent, richeous approach to making fucking crank in your garage. I just wanted to get a simplified A/B method, as my sense of self worth isnt based on how competant I am at cooking up drugs. And as per your advice, I injected grandma with 5g of pure cyonide in her sleep. I`m sure it was a great high, because she twitched and shivered and foamed at the mouth until peacefully bloating in a pool of her own excretions. If were as stupid as you treat me, I guess you wouldnt feel any sense of guilt for suggesting such a thing if I were to actually do it. Selective evolution? Thanks for the help.
Sun_Rah Member	posted 10-28-1999 05:07 PM I always wondered what it would be like to watch someone do a RP/I2/E reduction with enough regiments to actually leave the E in all the fillers, I mean not even extracting it just powder then mix fully, completely with rp then add I2mix and add a dab of dh20......any one else thought of this or am i just a dumass with dreams of easiness I am sure I am not the only one thinking of this? Seems like the oil would still make it out? Just some thoughts.....
Hematite Member	posted 10-28-1999 06:35 PM Now see in my shortcut, I would crush a few aspirin, couple of panadol and a few that the names have rubbed off but really mellow you out....and hopefully the poison properties of the final product wouldn't hurt too bad, smart huh ! ------------------ Regards,Hematite.
Snotbrain Member	posted 10-28-1999 07:54 PM If in waren't fer all the stuk-up peeples whut wanna smoke this shee-it, it woodn't evun mattter if the guauifenereeesding and gloygenpolycolglugogen and udder stuff were in the produckt. JUst swaller the stuff and dont to worrry aboot it . But then, hell, jus take a cuuple uh effedrine and soodyefedrine and cafienne pills and safe de trubble anyhoo. snodder
Fitzhugh Member	posted 10-28-1999 10:09 PM bluenote: You were not very descriptive of your reduction method or your A/B extraction method. You could have problems with either. Based on what I have read elsewhere, after you have raised the pH to around 12, you need to shake the ronsonal and the water layers together very thourghly. (In a closed bottle you should shake vigorusly for at least 2 minutes, venting the bottle every 30 seconds or so.) After shaking, you need to check the pH of the water layer again to make sure it is still about 12. If not, add more lye and shake again. Repeat until the final pH stays near 12. You will then want to draw off the ronsonol and repeat the process with one or two more volumes of ronsonol, adding all of the batches of ronsonol together. Base on your description of the water extraction, you would then add water and HCl, once again shaking and checking that the pH remains under 2 or 3, adding more HCl as necessary and shaking more. Draw off the water layer and repeat the water and HCl steps twice more. Add all the water volumes together and evaporate the water. From what I have read, the mixing and checking of the pH are critical to getting the final product where you want it. Also from what I have read, there are several places where you could do some fairly simple cleanup steps that wouldn't reduce you yield, but would make your product kinder to your bod, and a good deal tastier. I would recomend you do a bit more reading on purification steps.
Midnight Rush Member	posted 10-29-1999 01:37 AM Just a quick correction on your acid phase of the A/B. Ph 3 is way to low. It should be around ph 7
Worlock Member	posted 10-29-1999 03:09 AM You want to evaporate away a solution of HI, I2, Meth-I salts, various ammoniated hydrocarbons and several N,N-biphenyl-ethyl substances ? Might be a little tough to breathe when the HI starts coming off. The neutralization of the acids, must be done. So why not just raise the pH to 12 leaving you with meth freebase in a nonpolar solvent. 95% cleaned by just adding and flushing the lye Then How hard is it to add water and HCl, shake and reduce the pH to neutral 7.0 to 8.0.
bluenote Junior Member	posted 10-29-1999 04:07 AM "How hard is it to add water and HCl, shake and reduce the pH to neutral 7.0 to 8.0." Well put Worlock. I wondered this myself everytime. I think the problem has been adding the HCL. The amounts of e/rp/i are so low, when adding just one drop of HCL seems to put the Ph at a level of below 6. Maybe use a higher volume of dh20 at this step? Hmmm, I honestly have no problems with any other stage of this very simple experiment. Thanks for the input....
Midnight Rush Member	posted 10-29-1999 06:38 AM Or just use a dilute HCL. If you're using hardware store stuff it's normaly only trying to remember like 48% or was it 58% concentration. If that's to strong mix in a little water. Second thought Would it be possible to premix a solution to the proper ph and then add it to the substance? In my uneducated mind it seems that it would work other than the product giving the premixed solution a base. But that would be easy to fix by having the ph of the water a little more acid, maybe 6.5 and if the ph were still a little low you could add a little of the freebase that was set aside? If it worked would it also have a positive influence on yield by not having the HCL burning anything before it gets mixed? Midnight, looking for ways to keep product out of PHing as much as possible.
whoops Member	posted 10-29-1999 05:02 PM Try thinking tube furnace the ph varies from top to bottom all ya got to do is slowly circulate the solution and then let your screen filter out the goodies in the appropiate dimensional portal, really could not be simpler
cactus Member	posted 10-29-1999 05:29 PM This method can work but you should at least strain the I2 water then add some boiling water to flask to clean that out and then the hot water added to the I2 reaction solution will be more pleased to release the product into the uper layer of naptha. Then you will have to remove the naptha layer and then gas with HCI. Then you will have Methamphetamine crystals floating around. Strain this and wash with acitone but you will have to do several pulls of the I2 water. Simply add more fuel and sprinkle lye. Even the first time you only want to sprinkle a little lye. This way you don't burn every thing up at once. And also if the solvent isn't very dry the HCI gas will not produce crystals. Then the fuel needs to have a little acetone added and a little microwave reduction. Simply place into the microwave for 3 minutes as long as you dont evaperate every thing. The first pull may be small but second will be large and the 3rd 4th and 5th will decrease. You are really doing an A/B extraction. At least It sounds like you are attempting a harmless proceedure. There are problems with lye but you should filter each solvent pull and the lye will simply stick to the glass you need a lot of mason jars and simply decant off fuel untill no lye is present and then reduce and gas. This is the fastest way to sample you product 10 minutes after the reaction. ------------------ Live With Freedom
Worlock Member	posted 10-30-1999 01:53 PM bluenote I am totally lost here. Granny reacted the I/E/RP, filtered out the RP added ronson fuel, added lye water to incease pH to 12 -14 shake flush the lye water, I2, I-, and other trash added fresh water shake add HCl adjust pH to 7-8 quote: until ph on water is about 12-14 ..... replaced with clean water and HCL is added, but ph seems to remain low despite the amount of HCL added. The pH should drop from 12 to 7 How does it "remain" low??
bluenote Junior Member	posted 10-30-1999 06:48 PM Lets see, I think I wrote that backwards. After removing lye/shit solution, fresh h20 is added. At that point ph is higher than 7-8. So one drop of hcl is added. That one drop has proved to be too much. It immediatly lowers ph to 3-4. So, as in my previous post, it was realized that a greater volume of h20 to add the acid to would be better, as it would dilute the acid. Q: If a Ph of 7.5 or so, is not maintained in the water, would that mean the meth is not released from the fuel? Or just that the meth isnt functional at any other Ph level?
Android Member	posted 10-30-1999 07:28 PM You lost Worlock and now you have to go find him! These dedicated soldiers have sacrificed years out of their lives simplifying this hardware store, OTC method, and you got it so complicated ya set em back 5 years! Right on, killer! You rock! Now, go find Worlock! ------------------ These Irish eyes are smiling!
bennie Member	posted 10-30-1999 11:48 PM Cactus Could you please elaborate on the microwave/ solvent drying technique you mentioned Thanks
Sawman Member	posted 10-31-1999 08:27 AM Listening to these newbees is really funny. Trying to redesine the wheel again?
Hematite Member	posted 10-31-1999 08:47 AM After only a brief read, forgive me if this isn't relevant; If one drop of acid lowers your aqueous solution to 3/4 after thoroughly mixing with the solvent and having been allowed time to settle before testing....Then rest assured you have no meth there at all.Sorry. ------------------ Regards,Hematite.
Android Member	posted 10-31-1999 09:43 AM And we have a winner, folks! Step right up and pick your prize! ------------------ These Irish eyes are smiling!
CHEMMAN Member	posted 11-01-1999 05:45 AM I am not flaming you now bluenote.Instead I offer a valid shortcut with purity ,and ease of use.Its called a HCl gas generator . Advantages are clean product , Quick,No Phing worries.Simply gas np layer.Study this one up
rev drone Member	posted 11-01-1999 08:02 AM I've been working on this for you for a while. I was going to call it the "twist/lift/twitch" method, then the "yank/turn" method, but I streamlined the whole process, and came up with the amazing "shimmy/jolt/push-up-daisies/pull" method. Here's a shortcut: 1. See how much iodine you can dissolve in half a shotglass of everclear. 2. Add a gram or two of red phosphorous, and a few grams of ephedrine. 3. Over the teeth, and past the gums, look out internal organs, cuz here it comes! Chug that shot like a real man/woman!! Clearly, your goal is slowly poisoning yourself, rather than making methaphetamine of decent quality; so why dilly-dally? This method will certainly accomplish what you're settig out on, and in a fraction of the time. ------------------ -the good reverend drone
whoops Member	posted 11-01-1999 12:12 PM Allrighty then lets review this setup! A it is a tube furnace. b it proc3ess the meterial c it is not complicated though fine adjustments may be necessary D the reduction happens because of proposed hypothesis++++++++++++==========the formation of CO at one of the ellectrodes and precipation until saturation of Naoh and the reduction because of formation of Co2 co2 is a gas when forming from CO carbon monoxide this is a reduction this is optomized with solvent portion to simply steal the available oxygen and leave the ephedrine in the Clorinated state, cloring to sat on one side of upside down water glass trick, solvent water could be seperated by upside test tube in upside down water glass,.....thus we also add a stirrer and this seperates by graviety the heaveyst up against the wall, um the is a shure way to figure if this is producing co2? Co? of hydrogen????? What happens when you mix Naoh Clorine Hcl NaCL hydrogen carbon e- and water???? The water is reduced to oh the clorine ion is seperated from nacl to cl2 the hydrogen ion is liberated "" to h+h=H2[g] thus incompatable in water Na becomes Naoh at the reduction site of the water Carbon could be considered the metaloid, it is transfered from the donating electrode to the recieving ellectrode, now who is it in here thats got that unknown ellement figured out therew was two of them ellements mentioned I whant details man?????? Ok so ya mix Naoh and Acid, now the big difference between Naoh and baking soda is what, comon I need this information!!!! Repeate what the difference in the formation or how to stuff between baking soda and Naoh??????? Thanks? A010
cactus Member	posted 11-09-1999 03:52 PM Bennie Yes you place the toulene solution that was setting on top of the reation solution into a bowl. Before the solution is poured into bowl the toulene that was setting on top of the solution had a small amount of lye sprinkled on top. The lye will go to the bottom and streams of bubbles will surface. When you place the top layer into the bowl by pulling with a sqeeze bottle. It then is gassed to see if crystals are produced. If it doesnt add acitone and whatch for a minute if nothing happens then place the bowl into the microwave for 3 or 4 minutes depending on how much solvent is there. I believe this removes water and reduces the solvent. Take out the bowl and place under a fan and the material will start producing cyristals. This has to be done in a dry atmosphere such as modern air condition. You can place the bowl in front of your return vent of your central air handler. Then just add another batch of toulene on top of the reaction fluid and repeat obove step. Any time you pull off the reaction water filter the toulene. Also the Sodium Hydroxide sticks to glass so just keep tranfering to other clean glass containers untill lye isn't sticking to glass. I wipe the glass off with blue paper shop towels. ------------------ Live With Freedom
FMAN Member	posted 11-09-1999 04:30 PM Wor 10-30 the problemo could be related to hydrogen donator in the water part of the solution, now I aint shure wich solvent is being employed exactly, but the multi thing and freeze works good for most, considering the possiblity of the hydrogen sucking off the fuel layer and falling into a trap in the water layer is a definate possibility, allowing the hydrogen in the solvent to stabalize might be necessary to remove the water portion of the solvent in classic situation, thus is the thing being done in the Dron style or is it being done in classic style? In a test tube the freebased stuff in solvent is washed with a lye solution to alow some water soluable contaminates out, hopefully this is a heavy water compared to the solvent? Then the lye is further washed out with a portion of pure water, leaving a better solution to work with in theory, how rushed this becomes can be an important consideration, thus poor guy is in a hurry? Um so a drop of indicator is added with a drop of water into the test tube containing the suspect salt to issolate and it is adjusted to the proper PH evident by shaking and allowing resolution of the water droplets on the bottom layer, the color in this droplet changes as acid is added, this is the indicator Hum so ya can add some acid to some base and ya form salt, good very well understand how to make salt and how to undo salt. Hum so this is the real question? No, guy complains of a bunch of gak, um poision? Hummm well One might try to issolate from the mixture the salt and the amine, now considering if ya gots salt and amine in solution the solution is then allowed to resolve without heat into crytstals, these crystals might be salt or amine salt crystals??? Well at this specific issoellectric point not discussed it aint the question,,,anyways the amine salt will also ussually occur unless......oh if the salt HCL is in compound resembling our target molecule it is not preferentually reduced or otherwise gasses off the solution in preference or before simple stuff that in the like of this idea means salt.....we know ammonia loves water and also salt but under certain circumstances the salt does not love water as much as the ammonia, who has frozen water to seperate ammonia? anyways the salt will stay in the water wheras the uncomplicated salt will leave, thus lye is removed from and influenced by gravity, and at othertimes becomes boyant, dont ask. Anyways the por thing has allready been displayed and a ground or nutral pH has allready been reported, how to adjust this to macroscal will involve allowing the somic stuff in there or the poor thing is gona need some awfull violent and complex lasser stuff, to also likewise initiate the appropiate cascade of events, needless to say this is a hurry thing? Gosh be boggle ya might have something in there that has not been isolated,,,ok so try different method, make super chilled of that stuff the solvent and make shure it has whtever gak might be dumped in there all kinda stuff, make a good and diversive mixture of solvent stuff and grind the goodies up, how to get rid of or deactivate the phosphor seems to be a little problem but who knows I can easilly deactivate a cn, so if there is a good way um I aint seen it...Maybe I just dont know how to get rid of the phosphor question without having titled or been real specific it seems like more of and end to itself at this juncture is a waste of my time. I would add some wtare and have available some acid in that water at the same token I would employ a multi role to all solution and chemical mixtures immediatly and if issolating a specific regemin keep it simple like NA this is not a comercial venture,,,the best way to rid the phosphor question seems paramount as a critism in my opinion herin the report is a complaint about the process, why do I dont get the real reason to add phosphorus straight into the reaction mixture it just aint propper
FMAN Member	posted 11-09-1999 05:22 PM You are making salt water to preferientiate the leaving of the basic amine [partner acid is attached] to the solvent layer wich is high in trapped hydrogen content, see adding lye does make salt and it steals this salt stuff from the lesser ammine to make ions in the water[which is less basic than the amine?],oh the water becomes more basic than the amine of courrse the ammine is then allowed to seek a more compatable and stable friend in the solvent which for pracality is said to be saturated in hydrogen. Thus the amine tries to move into solvent at potential of concerning the issoellectric point, adjusting it to the said PH um is a little extravigant, in nay case causes the thing to go into the solvent ussually never the less, the key point here is that the stronger base formed in water solution and thus the amine is repelled out of or forced to the edges, and in glass if ya overpotentiate the lye the lye attacks the glass, anyways the whole might be corrected buy employing a gradual tempature gradient against the solution containg the water, thus at PH of say 7+ in the water and the stuff in there the lye it is or becomes supersaturate at a point of say X pressure and water is a cooler pressure thing thatn anything else I know of, so if we reduce the tempature less salt or lye in this case is allowed to reside in the solution and or does the PH change? Well it is a very good question??? Hum so um a I am still investigationg this phenomena, seemingly allthough the pH has not changed this does become a very different method alltogether, so as ya cool this salt water something real weird happens the lye and salt formed becomes reentrained in the water matrix, and most of the impurity is forced out the impurity happens to be the stuff we want anyways, and little gas bubbles of water appear in the forming solid water mass as the result of? Um maybe the latice is reacting to um it is allowing the salt to become seperate than it forming little cages of gas or emptyness around dirt or salt, and these empty cages might be in time discovered to contain say the complimentary netralization gass found in the water to nutralize the um contaminant, this in this case being Hydrogen for clorine and oxygen for sodium and sometimes other trace gasses are employed as the result it is indeed a very complex rational to evolve into hering this is the basic rational for it, understand or fail. Many gasses are present in water such as in to certain degree to whatever catalyst might be contained therin, thus co might be at a very high level in pure water before alowing for expulsion wherass oxygen gas is at a minumium....hummmm so argon and nitrogen are also in there, of course these can all be measure with appropiate equipment which is much more complex than suited for clandestine discussion presently, clandestine may mean you dont know why but it happens because it is the way it is and ya cant change this So considering the ammine has left the water to allow it into a hydrogen attractant in the solvent,, humm adding the above paradigm is allowed in reverse from the classic water thing, see if solvent or oil is allowed to float or become light, in this case it aint soluable inwater due to it has become light in any case and has disolved into the solvent due to the attration of the hydrogen component in the lkattice there, along the way it will be discovered also that some strange stuff is in the solvent and that will be gass of metal or rather more appropiate could be considered a carbon coponent or cyanide might be in there which also attarcts finly divided metals in well in my investigations this acts equall to the watereffect which works good for myself in any case....ok so as the water cools it is further complicated by the gasses in the solvent and seemingly a membrane potential or gas difussion complicating and mitigating factor is present, thus it aint water and we know ammonia compounds usually love water but in this case most all of the water is getting sucked out as gas into the water becoming solid as to solvate the supersaturated condition it is becomming, I wa allway mystified by those strange stalagmite forms erupting from the ice surface, aside from that it does eventually seem to reform and resolve but a groth factor has to be considered? What has happened to cause the ammine to seperate from the solvent well we know that the gass above the vessel is constant and a vacume is being created and also this vacume is alowed to pass through the solvent and pressure is alluted in the ice, the hydrogen gas is suched into the crystaline latice preferentually because it is solvent, and solvent does love hydrogen stuff, and amine still loves the water but is attracted to the solvent, considering pressure and tempature are as constant and related to eachother as proposed and vacume is flowing through the solvent into the water which is becoming solidified and in ever constant need of more gass to nutralize itself, well it the amine is allowed to seperate out into the middle, um ya cant see it, hum bummer, ok so ya add something for the ammine to be attracted to um like likes like, so considering this thing likes is alot like something that can be moved into position to attract the ammine and also alow crystalization, this can be a complex issue, considering all that salt in the water layer, I just cant think of a way to employ such a salt for the extraction of such a similiar thing such as our product. Thus ya need to extract the dam salt of away from the product before hand to make it um work. although it might work anyways and in all kinda solvent and conditions with or without mitigating factors, the main problemo of the future will be issolating and seperating complex salts that are very similiar in all behavior to the target salts, because there are some deranged individuals who consider profit a supreem virtue and they will not alow shortcuts from there dividend. Um starting from raw product even if messed with with minimal effort the amine will allways be a easy thing to issolate I am shure of this fact, and that plants may be rown or fertalized in a away to capatalize on complex formation of various salts that could be or need not be purified in any manner, although the technology exists it will allways be the natual and basic thigns that pull ya through the more of these ya master will result in further clarification and differentiation from total bullish from stuff that is praticall for you at any given point in time hopefully less and less things sem bullish and ya try them in reality, it is my sinceere hop to find you crystal grown in a container near you if you so desire one -A010

All times are CT (US)	next newest topic \| next oldest topic
Administrative Options: Close Topic \| Archive/Move \| Delete Topic
	Hop to:

Contact Us | the Hive